History of term 'Redskins'

[Om]

Okay, so some people say the nickname "Redskins" is offensive. I've never actually met one of those people (the offended, not the Redskins), but I hear they're out there.

So what's the story, anyway? What's the real genesis of the term, and what was George Preston Marshall thinking when he changed the name from Boston Braves to Boston Redskins in 1933?

[beamish]

i always thought marshall named the team after an american indian -- i don't remember if he was a friend or even a player, which leads you to believe that marshall's intention was to honor, not to offend, someone.

[Huly]

Honestly I could claim membership with the Cherokee tribe. My aunt is a citizen of the tribe and her and I both have discussed this in detail and neither of us can figure out why some think it is offensive. If my history is correct I though there was an indian tribe named the Redskins.

[Walking Deadman]

You can actually thank the Red Sox for the Redskins name in a way.......

here was a post from my blog that I did about the origins of the team name and logo, although I'm sure others probably could have done a better write up.

http://walkingdeadmanblog.blogspot.com/2009/05/redskins-origins.html

[Boone]

You can actually thank the Red Sox for the Redskins name in a way.......

here was a post from my blog that I did about the origins of the team name and logo, although I'm sure others probably could have done a better write up.

http://walkingdeadmanblog.blogspot.com/2009/05/redskins-origins.html

Hey brother, shoot me your blogs rss feed url and I'll add you to our 'Redskins Blogs' forum so your blog entries show up here when you update :)

[Walking Deadman]

PM sent. Thanks.

[Yellow41]

When I meet a Native American I almost always ask if they are offended by the term. I have yet to get a negative response. The current logo was designed by a Native American.

[Tastes Like Chicken]

My understanding is that when some Indians prepared for battle, they would apply red war paint. In other words, they would put on their "red skins" and go whup some ass, like we do against the Cowpukes. Has nothing to do with the melanin or pigmentation of their skin.

[skinsfan44]

My grandmother (God rest her soul) was half Cherokee Indian and a huge Redskins fan.

Her and my grandfather both became fans when the Redskins moved to DC in 1937 listening to them on the radio.

Not once did she ever say that the term "Redskins" were offensive and she was very proud to have her team represent her heritage.

[HapHaszard]

i always thought marshall named the team after an american indian -- i don't remember if he was a friend or even a player, which leads you to believe that marshall's intention was to honor, not to offend, someone.

The story I heard was that one of the coaches was an american indian and he named the team after the coach.

[MR Historian]

Here's what I know about the selection of the nickname Redskins: The franchise was called the Boston Braves in its first season of existence in 1932. Owner George Preston Marshall chose that nickname to match with the National League baseball team; both teams played at Braves Field. (The NFL was only 12 years old, and it wasn't unusual at the time for a new football team to copy the nickname of the city's existing baseball team, i.e., Brooklyn Dodgers, New York Giants, Pittsburgh Pirates.)

Following the 1932 season, Marshall moved his team across town to Fenway Park, home of the American League's Boston Red Sox. He renamed his team the Redskins, pulling the "Red" from Red Sox and using "Skins" to maintain the Native American theme he had with the Braves. It's my undertstanding that Marshall didn't have any racist motives by selecting the nickname Redskins.

Around the same time, Marshall hired a new coach in William "Lone Star" Dietz, a part-blooded Native American. Dietz recruited six players from the Haskell Indian School in Kansas, where he'd once played with the great Jim Thorpe. Also, the players got a full makeover before the season-opener, wearing burgundy and gold uniforms and Indian war paint. Marshall was an entertainer at heart, and he wanted his squad to have its own uniqueness.

[Sarge]

For those of you that don't know my history from "the other board", my Mom was Mr Cookes personal secretary from 1984 until The Short One rode into town in 99 and they were all fired.

Mr Cooke had a book, a large one, that was full of letters he had received over the years from American Indians (both fans and non-fans) sayng how proud they were that a professional football team had been named after them. Or in the later years when things started going PC, they simply wrote to say they took no offense to the name.

There are always going to be a loudmouthed few that hollar when it serves their purpose or is politically expediant. There may even be a few who are geuinely offended, but I think it's a very small minority

[beamish]

your anecdote speaks volumes, sarge.

the only issue that gives me pause are the stories that i've heard that marshall was a bigot. wasn't he the last bastion of segregation in the nfl? i know, a different time and a different world. but this side of marshall may be what fuels the debate when redskin history is interpreted (or misinterpreted).

[Sarge]

It could well.

All I know is that Mr Cooke wasn't bothered by the name and surely wasn't going to change it. I asked him directly one time in the late 80's if he was going to change the name and he said "certainly not".

Like I said, he had that book, and it was rather thick

[Pravda]

Sarge,

After all these years, I never knew that about your mom--very interesting and thanks for sharing. I bet you've got a million anecdotes like the one you've shared in this thread about JKC's book. Pretty cool. :)

[brandies]

Living in Montana my only observation would be that there are many more positive ways to help out Native Americans other than making a ruckus over a harmless name. It seems like an affliction of my generation in that we need a cause even if there is no cause to be had.

[MikeSr619]

Living in Montana my only observation would be that there are many more positive ways to help out Native Americans other than making a ruckus over a harmless name. It seems like an affliction of my generation in that we need a cause even if there is no cause to be had.

I agree here. For those reservations that arent fortunate enough to be able to build casinos there are so many things that need to be done. Jobs, schools, hospitals. I lived on a reservation in Northern California for 5 years and the lack of jobs alone made it difficult to survive. Plus introduce alcohol and drugs and it just makes it a very sad scene.

[beamish]

ran across this historical account of the Redskin term...

"...One interesting piece of evidence is the origin of the name Washington Redskins. In 1933, George Preston Marshall, the owner of the team, which was then located in Boston, renamed it the Boston Redskins in honor of the head coach, William "Lone Star" Dietz, an American Indian. When the team moved to Washington in 1937 it was renamed the Washington Redskins. George Marshall clearly did not consider the name disparaging."

"...the term redskin is a translation from native American languages of a term used by native Americans for themselves... The term entered popular usage via the novels of James Fenimore Cooper. In the early- to mid-nineteenth century the term was neutral, not pejorative, and indeed was often used in contexts in which whites spoke of Indians in positive terms."

see detail with citations:
http://itre.cis.upenn.edu/~myl/languagelog/archives/002961.html

[L J]

For those of you that don't know my history from "the other board", my Mom was Mr Cookes personal secretary from 1984 until The Short One rode into town in 99 and they were all fired.

Mr Cooke had a book, a large one, that was full of letters he had received over the years from American Indians (both fans and non-fans) sayng how proud they were that a professional football team had been named after them. Or in the later years when things started going PC, they simply wrote to say they took no offense to the name.

There are always going to be a loudmouthed few that hollar when it serves their purpose or is politically expediant. There may even be a few who are geuinely offended, but I think it's a very small minority

I'm really glad to know this about you Sarge, as I only recall the tail end of a previous era.:cool4:
- I am "part" native american, not enough to be a member of the Creek tribe though. It is a heritage I've always been proud of, and when I first became a fan at age 7, that is one of the reasons- the native American theme to the team. So for me, I find it an honor to be represented.

[MikeSr619]

In about 50 years we are all going to be members of every tribe.

and hopefully have nice tans too because sometimes I swear Im so white Im transparent..

[Sarge]

I'm really glad to know this about you Sarge, as I only recall the tail end of a previous era.:cool4:


I am not a mooooooooooonster:anonymous:

[21Teezy]

what a fantastic post. Thank you very much for the link to the article. Did anyone read the speeches by the Native Americans? Great stuff. Sad to read though.

[beamish]

anyone listening to the wise show on 106.7?
mike is going off on the team name - ready to launch a campaign to change it...

claims doc walker was told by an american indian that 'redskin' is akin to the n-word.

[honorary_hog]

anyone listening to the wise show on 106.7?
mike is going off on the team name - ready to launch a campaign to change it...

claims doc walker was told by an american indian that 'redskin' is akin to the n-word.

With all due respect to said American Indian, if it actually happened, GTFO of here. I don't think there is any word in the english language that carries the connotation that the n-word does in the United States.

This person may well have taken offense to the term, but the word "Redskin" wasn't used to beat down an entire race of people for decades.

We all have our own sensitivities and things that push our buttons. Lord knows I do. But to me, the two words could not possibly be more different in their usage.

One of the other things that really frustrates me about this whole debate is the difference between our logo, and say, the Cleveland Indians. I mean, theirs is a cartoon. And yet that doesn't seem to offend anyone. Frankly, I think our logo is as stately and dignified as you will find in sports. I think just looking at it, it's easy to see that -- if anything -- it was intended as a show of respect.

If anyone is "mocking" American Indians in professional sports, I'd say the Indians are far more guilty than are we.

[MikeSr619]

wasnt the N word originally used to mean ignorant person? I know what it was turned in to..but that wasnt the original meaning behind it.

the same could be said for redskin. when an indian gets sunburnt his skin does turn a deep, dark red. i lived on a rez for many years..this is just the truth. its like calling a kid with freckles "freckle face"..its just true.

now what it turned in to is a different story.

[Rymanofthenorth]

I'm metis, which means one side of my family has north american indian blood. (Cree to be exact).

When I was a kid the asshats in moccasins showed up in paddle Prairie (the metis settlement im from) to get people all riled up about the Redskins, Braves , chiefs and Blackhawks. They didnt tell anyone what the meeting was for so a bunch of us showed up wearing redskins apparel (our peewee and bantam football coach was a huge redskins fan so most of us were too) when I got there one sof the goons tried to tell me to take off the hoody I was wearing because "it was an insult to our people" I told him if he touched me again he would be eating bloody chiclets. Merv was wearing a Redskins ballcap and some nerd got up in his face and almost got knocked out lol

they tried to bully people into saying that they were offended by the emblems of the blackhawks, redskins and cheif but it was a tough sell when half of us were wearing those teams merchandise lol.

I know redskin used to be a derogatory term based on the fact that many tribes in the eastern states have dark reddish tones, but indians where im from are all more a brown colour with only the sioux and sarcee being a reddish tone. interesting fact, the Dene tha indians who supposedly lived in northern alberta for "thousands of years" (in actuality closer to 200 or so) speak an almost identical language to the navaho in arizona and even look identical, while my people the Cree look more like natives in Siberia.

[Yusuf06]

wasnt the N word originally used to mean ignorant person? I know what it was turned in to..but that wasnt the original meaning behind it.
You're on the right track. There's a great treatise on how it originated here--(NSFW for obvious reasons) (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kNSwuSQS8a8).